User talk:Verdy p

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Latest comment: 3 years ago by Awangba Mangang in topic Speciesbox

#REDIRECTw:fr:Discussion Utilisateur:Verdy p
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Appreciation[edit source]

@Verdy p:: Thank you for your contributions in Wp/mni/ꯃꯔꯨꯑꯣꯏꯕ ꯂꯃꯥꯏ but in this page we don't need English script. If you want to help in Wp/mni Contribution,I need your help in {{Template creation}} A ꯷ 06:57, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

But informing users about which font they can use is essential, and justified for attracting users and let them start test this language correctly. It's a single banner at top, the rest can remain in the target language. Almost all incubators for languages in uncommon scripts have such top notice. Informing them that they can read the content is important (including for admins of this site that would like to track abuses and at least make a visual inspection. Also avoid using URL-encoded links: they should all use the native script directly (so don't copy links from the address bar, use the actual page titles).
It's not my intent to put English everywhere.
And I suggest you also add the message in Minipuri with the Bengali script (so that local contributors that still use only the Bengali script and are not aware that the Meetei Mayek script is also working will know how to read it. Then they'll start installing an input method or keyboard layout to start inputing data).
I may help in designing a translitterator (in Javascript) for input using a Bengali or QWERTY layout. That script is much less complicate than Bengali or Devanagari.
And there's a still a lot of English already in the central part of the page, which is more important to translate (including the top thematic menu). Verdy p (talk) 09:45, 23 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

@Verdy p:,but this link is not working It will be good if you make transliteration from qwerty to Meetei mayek, I will invite more freind to take part in creating articles who have little knowledge on meetei mayek. I need your help in this template {{Template:Wp/mni/DYKbox}} And some infobox, Modules for many countries like this Module:Wp/mni/ISO 3166/data/NL

A ꯷ 12:13, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

The link IS REALLY working and is accurate (you don't even need to be connected to GitHub with a GitHub account to get it).
It is the official place on GitHub where it is released (it is also released on the Google "Get Noto" page, but there the direct link is not possible; Google republishes these fonts, but frequently with some additional delays, but even Google instructs visitors to visit the GitHub development site).
The download link is in that page (which describes it summarily and gives the size: 15.7 KB), with the explicit "download" button for the "raw" file, because it is binary (TTF) and cannot be viewed directly. Verdy p (talk) 13:47, 23 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

@Verdy p:, How to correct this population error Wp/mni/ꯁ꯭ꯄꯦꯅꯤꯁ ꯂꯣꯟ. A ꯷ 02:07, 25 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

It's the same error: as there's a missing template, trying to transclude it generates a red wikilink (between "[[]]") to the name of the missing template. But the syntax of expressions does not allow any "[[]]" and you get this error. So this is a missing template that needs to be created, and used inside an expression. Verdy p (talk) 05:24, 25 July 2019 (UTC)Reply
You can know which template is missing by editing the page: there's a list of transcluded templates (including missing ones, shown in red), at the bottom of the edit form. Verdy p (talk) 05:27, 25 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

Something when wrong![edit source]

@Verdy p: What is wrong in this template I can't figure out - {{Wp/mni/Main page image}} A ꯷ 11:19, 24 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

Beware of very old (and very inefficient) legacy templates. Also You don't need to prefix the pseudo-template {{!}} because it is implemented as a magic keyword; if you prefix it (with "Wp/mni/"), it forces your to use a much slower template.
Anyway legacy string handling templates should be avoided. They were created many years ago when Mediawiki had no other choice. Use builtin parser functions if possible.
The error you had was because there was a missing template, its inclusion was expanded as a red wikilink starting by "[", causing then an error in expressions. I commented out that template (used to trim numbers: you never need it it, a simpler way to trim a value is to use it in the result branch of a dummy "#if" which is much more efficient than using a template for that). E.g. :
{{#if:|| this value will be trimmed without using any template }}, or
{{#if:1| this value will be trimmed without using any template }} (this is equivalent)
Verdy p (talk) 14:17, 24 July 2019 (UTC)Reply
Note: I use the following line in my /vector.css or /monobook.css subpage of my user page (on all wikis):
@import url(;
You can use it too (from any wiki, and not just those from Wikimedia). It allows configuring fonts to display ALMOST ALL Unicode characters (my "polices.css" stylesheet was built progressively and I maintain it to support more and more scripts added to Unicode. Note that it does not install these fonts. It lists and configures fonts shipped with Windows or Android, and a few known fonts used by the community
It also references the Noto fonts (that are used in preference to all others because it has consistant metrics across all scripts and the set of fonts has the largest coverage and the best quality of implementation, supporting also scripts with complex layouts like Indic scripts; the fonts are well maintained; they were initially contributed by Google, but they are now opensourced and many contributors work on them, and Google reuses them later for shipping on Android, and performs its own quality checks; but these fonts are completely free for use, under a SIL Open Font licence, compatible with Wikimedia and almost all open projects; only the Noto CJK fonts containing the Han ideographs in the BMP, are under an Adobe licence, because their development is very complex and lengthy, but progressively they are being purged, but CJK ideographs in the BMP are now well covered by all other systems and by multiple alternatives, including free ones, so you are not required to install the Noto CJK fonts, even if they are among the best available for now and do not requrie any payment). All Noto fonts can then be freely redistributed, except the "Noto CJK SC/TC/JP/KR *" fonts which have to be downloaded from official Noto support sites of Google and from the official GitHub (which now belongs to Microsoft, not Google), or from sites that have a redistribution licence from Adobe.
Note that Wikimedia has installed these Noto fonts for the internal SVG rendering (as PNG) on its own image servers, but still not configured the default stylesheets of its wikis to use them for the content! Verdy p (talk) 14:42, 24 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

This time also I need your help[edit source]

@Verdy p:: Can you help in creating keyboard (Android) for Meetei mayek or for transliteration. I want qwerty keyboard because it types faster.

Qwerty to Meetei mayek
  • K •••••••••• ꯀ (U+ABC0): "kok" (ka)
  • S •••••••••• ꯁ (U+ABC1): "sam" (sa)
  • L •••••••••• ꯂ (U+ABC2): "lai" (la)
  • M •••••••••• ꯃ (U+ABC3): "mit" (ma)
  • P •••••••••• ꯄ (U+ABC4): "pa"
  • N •••••••••• ꯅ (U+ABC5): "na"
  • C •••••••••• ꯆ (U+ABC6): "chil" (ca)
  • T •••••••••• ꯇ (U+ABC7): "til" (ta)
  • Kh •••••••••• ꯈ (U+ABC8): "khou" (kha)
  • Ng •••••••••• ꯉ (U+ABC9): "ngou" (nga)
  • Th •••••••••• ꯊ (U+ABCA): "thou" (tha)
  • W •••••••••• ꯋ (U+ABCB): "wai" (wa)
  • Y •••••••••• ꯌ (U+ABCC): "yang" (ya)
  • H •••••••••• ꯍ (U+ABCD): "huk" (ha)
  • U •••••••••• ꯎ (U+ABCE): "un" (u)
  • E •••••••••• ꯏ (U+ABCF): "i"
  • F •••••••••• ꯐ (U+ABD0): "pham" (pha)
  • A •••••••••• ꯑ (U+ABD1): "atiya" (a)

  • G •••••••••• ꯒ (U+ABD2): "gok" (ga)
  • Z •••••••••• ꯓ (U+ABD3): "jham" (jha/za)
  • R •••••••••• ꯔ (U+ABD4): "rai" (ra)
  • B •••••••••• ꯕ (U+ABD5): "ba"
  • J •••••••••• ꯖ (U+ABD6): "jil" (ja)
  • D •••••••••• ꯗ (U+ABD7): "dil" (da)
  • Q •••••••••• ꯘ (U+ABD8): "ghou" (gha/qa)
  • X •••••••••• ꯙ (U+ABD9): "dhou" (dha)
  • V •••••••••• ꯚ (U+ABDA): "bham" (bha/va)
  • ꯛ •••••••••• ꯛ (U+ABDB): "kok lonsum" (final k)
  • ꯜ ••••••••••••• ꯜ (U+ABDC): "lai lonsum" (final l)
  • ꯝ ••••••••••••• ꯝ (U+ABDD): "mit lonsum" (final m)
  • ꯞ •••••••••••• ꯞ (U+ABDE): "pa lonsum" (final p)
  • ꯟ ••••••••••••• ꯟ (U+ABDF): "na lonsum" (final n)
  • ꯠ ••••••••••••• ꯠ (U+ABE0): "til lonsum" (final t)
  • ꯡ ••••••••••••• ꯡ (U+ABE1): "ngou lonsum" (final ng)
  • O •••••••••• ꯭꯭ (U+ABED): "apun yiek" vowel dropper sign
  • 1 ••••••••••• ꯥ (U+ABE5): combining vowel "anap" (aa)
  • 2 •••••••• ꯤ (U+ABE4): combining vowel "inap" (i)
  • 3 ••••••••••• ꯦ (U+ABE6): combining vowel "yenap" (e)
  • 4 •••••••••• ꯣ (U+ABE3): combining vowel "onap" (o)
  • 5 ••••••••••• ꯪꯪ (U+ABEA): combining vowel "nung" (anusvara)
  • 6 ••••••••••• ꯩ (U+ABE9): combining vowel "cheinap" (ei)
  • 7 ••••••••••• ꯧ (U+ABE7): combining vowel "sounap" (ou)
  • 8 ••••••••• ꯨꯨ (U+ABE8): combining vowel "unap" (u)
  • 9 •••••••••ꯀ꯬ (U+ABEC): combining heavy tone
  • ; •••••••••• ;
  • : •••••••••• :
  • ' ••••••••••• '
  • " ••••••••••• "
  • | •••••••••• |
  • . •••••••••• ꯫ (U+ABEB)
  • , •••••••••• ꫰ (U+AAF0, supplement)
  • ? ••••••••••• ꫱ (U+AAF1, supplement)
  • ( ••••••••••• (
  • ) ••••••••••• )
  • [ ••••••••••• [
  • ] ••••••••••• ]
  • { ••••••••••••• {
  • } ••••••••••••• }
  • < ••••••••••• <
  • > ••••••••••• >
  • - ••••••••••• -
  • + ••••••••••• +
  • * ••••••••••• *
  • / •••••••••• /
  • \ •••••••••• \
  • % ••••••••••  %
  • # ••••••••••• #
  • @ •••••••••• @
  • & •••••••••• &
  • $ •••••••••• $
  • ~ ••••••••••• ~
  • ^ ••••••••••• ^
  • ` ••••••••••• `
  • _ ••••••••••• _

Keyboard style (Android?.???)

  • mode 1
    • 1st row: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0
    • 2nd row: q w e r t y u i o p
    • 3rd row: a s d f g h j k l
    • 4th row: ₹ z x c v b n m delete/cut
    • 5th row : (?123/ChangePhase) emoji coma BlankSpace FullStop search/JumpToNextLine
  • mode 2
    • 1st row: ꯛ ꯜ ꯝ ꯞ ꯟ ꯠ ꯡ | # /
    • 2nd row: ꯱ ꯲ ꯳ ꯴ ꯵ ꯶ ꯷ ꯸ ꯹ ꯰
    • 3rd row: ~ * ' : ! ? Cut/Delete
    • 4th row = Same as Uk/USA keyboard of 4th row
  • mode 3
    • 1st row : @ { - • = } " $ £ €
    • 2nd row : [ > < ] % ) (+ _ ;
    • 3rd row : Same as UK keyboard style
    • 4th row: same as Uk keyboard style

A ꯷ 10:23, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

I cannot make a native keyboard for Android, but I can tune the javascript support in the Wiki editor
This means that the physical layout does not really matter, what will account is just the characters you type from any keyboard, and which is then transliterated in the input form.
Basically it would be the same kind as other transliterators in Wikipedia; or in the Google Translate web site: it does not require any application or driver to be installed.
But I could also provide you a native keymap driver for Windows to do a physical layout (it is not long to create and it generates DLLs containing actually no code except a "return" of a datatable; the driver then is only used to load data in the generic Windwos keyboard driver; I would not create complete driver, just this minidriver; complete drivers like Keyman have integration issues in apps and compatibility issues).
Note: you can see the full Unicode table on the French wikipedia page: w:fr:Meitei mayek
It is up to date for the Unicode mapping (and viewable, directly, not like the English Wikipedia). The French Unicode tables can display the full Unicode set without any mojibake.
This page also contains the two blocks: U+ABC0..U+ABFF (base) and U+ABC0..U+AAFF (supplement). It shows all diacritics (in blue cells), punctuation, and digits.
Note that you propose "E" instead of "I" above; there's also an letter "E" in the extended block, which also has other letters, like "O", "Ch(a)", "Ny(a)", "Tt(a)", "Tth(a)", "Dd(a)", "Ddh(a)", "Nn(a)", "Sh(a)", "Ss(a)", plus other vowel signs "ii" (long "i"), "uu" (long "u"), "aai" (long "ai"), "au", "aau" (long "au"); it also has the honorific "anji" symbol, and two repetition marks (for last syllable or last word), and adds two other diacritics: visarga, and virama (needed because not all consonants have a "final" version, notably for transcripting foreign words that have consonant clusters like "art" in English, "star", "psi", or other final but isolated consonnants like in "Bob"; but i still don't see the difference of this combining virama, with the "remover sign" not encoded as a diacritic but still used after a consonant and draw after it below the next character, except that this virama is much smaller and fits below and not after the consonnant).
For me it looks as if that script is not really a true abugida, but midway between an indic abugida and a syllabary like yi, simplified by using combining signs for many simple syllables, but without stacking the consonnants like in the Tibetan script. This also explains why the alphabetic orer is very strange and mixes consonnants and independant vowels.
Verdy p (talk) 16:20, 27 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

@Verdy p: How to used this w:fr:Meitei mayek. I am editing/writing article pages through Phone. A ꯷ 16:39, 27 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

Click to see w:fr:Meitei mayek rendered at full size.
Don't you see the full table on your phone ? May be it is an iPhone. This table displays properly in Android and Windows, with the Noto Meitei Mayek font installed (and on my Android phone it is already preinstalled). Verdy p (talk) 17:27, 27 July 2019 (UTC)Reply
It shows like on the image to the right. Verdy p (talk) 17:33, 27 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

@Verdy p: Actually meetei mayek should be in independent or isolated class (it shouldn't be Brahmi or abugida derivatives) Like Hebrew and Greek A ꯷ 02:11, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

Greek is evidently directly linked to Latin and Cyrillic that are direct adaptations of the alphabet. Hebrew also inherits from other Semitic alphabets. Meetei Mayek was a simplification of the classical Sino-Tibetan syllabaries (notably Yi) using principles coming from Brahmi, including by borrowing letter forms. Of course the language has nothing to do with Indo-Aryan, but the same is true for Dravidian languages (like Tamil or Telugu) that also used some Brahmi principles in their scripts. But the Meetei Mayek script is much more like Brahmi than Yi. And the language is also definitely not an isolate. Verdy p (talk) 03:20, 28 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

We meetei still need more research, we borrowed some grammatical rule of English which when sometimes applied we can't get correct form.

Since 1950s some pseudo scholars (Hindu believers) they invented some new script to link with Sanskrit (e.g like Anji ) When Britishers (1891) arrived in Manipur we meetei can't even find one who follows native religion Sanamahism as King Pamheiba (1709- 1750) and Bagiyachandra (1759–1762, 1763 – 1798) the above 2 king imposed Sanskrit should be our natives language and also to be a Hindu,during there realm if anybody Sings they have to be in Bangla or Sanskrit language if not king curses Or killed people who don't followed. In the year 1729 King Pamheiba collected all historical documents,religious texts which are written in meetei mayek burnt it.

  • So, In our society we have some factions
  1. King and their relatives (particularly Rajkumaar Rajkumaari) - Hindu religion ( they wanted to link with Sanskrit and Hindu religion)
  2. Brahmin (They arrived Manipur in 15th century, we called Bamon in our language. We meetei society gives our women to be bride in good faith,as they were come from West Bengal and Bangladesh they also wanted to link anything (Cultural, religion and food habits) with Mainland india.
  1. Meitei they believed themselves to be true natives of Manipur in terms of language and religion(Sanamahism).

But,the term meitei comes only after TC Hudson(1908) The Meithei. Rajkumaar(King's relatives) and Bamon (Brahmin - mixed hybrid people) started writing many articles and books that our community name as Meitei .

  1. Meitei-Hindu they also want to link anything cultural and religion with Hindu and Sanskrit
  1. Meetei (when we look in etymology of the term Meetei still suitable, believed in one of oldest puya found in mankind Wakoklon Heelel Thilel Salai amai-lon Pukok puya)

These are people don't want to link Hindu and Sanskrit.I am one of them

  • According to these some factions

We have 7/8 scripts to write meetei language

  1. . 18 alphabet (Meetei)

(One of oldest script)

  1. . 35 alphabet (Meitei who want to link with Bengali script)


In the year 1989/1990 with many arguments discussion Gov.of Manipur approved 27 alphabet as (Mapi mayek) Creating new 9 letters from existing letter.

    • For Hindi Sanskrit Bengali

They write their alphabet in 5 columns

    • For Meetei Mayek we write alphabet in 3 columns

A ꯷ 03:13, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

Origin of Meetei mayek[edit source]

  • Kok ........(Head)
  • Sam .........(Hair)
  • Lai..........(Forehead)
  • Mit..........(Eye/eyes)
  • Pa...........(eyelashes)
  • Na............(Ear)
  • Chin...........(Lips)
  • Tin.............(Saliva)
  • Khou.............(Throat)
  • Ngou.............Pharynx
  • Thou............. Chest
  • Wai............ Nevel
  • Yang............Backbone
  • Huk.............. Lower spine
  • Un or oon........Skin
  • Ee............... Blood
  • pham...............Placenta
  • Ating-aa/Atiya.......Child/Sky

The remaining 9 are created from the previous 18 letters

(???: doubtful, they are most probably adaptation from Bengali/Assamese)

Writing styles:

  1. School......ꯁ꯭ꯀꯨꯜ
  2. I...........ꯑꯥꯏ
  3. art‌‌‌‌........ ꯑꯥꯔꯠ
  4. Star‌‌‌........ ꯁ꯭ꯇꯥꯔ

A ꯷ 02:11, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

I already know these origins (letters named natively like human body parts containing the sound in their name). However I cannot work on your request to me to develop an input method for Android (I don't have an Android developer account and won't pay Google to get the app hosted on Google Play. You may however ask it to Google support so they develop a suitable keymap). I can work however on a javascript transliterator working in the browser, and on adapting to the charmap tool displayed in the MediaWiki edit form. Verdy p (talk) 03:52, 28 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

Main page section[edit source]

@Verdy p: Can you help main page section Wp/mni/ꯃꯔꯨꯑꯣꯏꯕ ꯂꯃꯥꯏ : Todays feature articles A ꯷ 02:16, 31 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

Please post a new section at end of page (or create a new talk section with the "+" button at top of page), otherwise I don't know where you post and I need to look at page history and look at "diffs", to see where you posted something to ping me. This is a general remark applicable when talking to anyone on any wiki.
Also don't forget to sign your posts: type 4 tildes (19:59, 30 July 2019 (UTC)) at end of your message, or click the signature button in the editor toolbar). Make sure that your signature contains your user name with a link to your user page or talk page (it should be there by default in your preferences). Verdy p (talk) 10:43, 30 July 2019 (UTC)Reply
@Awangba Mangang: For the input method you want, you should contact this user from India, and also speaking Bengali natively that has already developped such a tool for Google Summer of Code 2016:
He may help you to reach your goal for this script, and review the usability layout and extend it to get more perfect coverage (including digits that you forgot)
I don't know how his input method works (is it in javascript and based on the wiki, or is it an app for Android). Verdy p (talk) 19:55, 30 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

This users active only on Twitter,his email address is not working.

  • What are digits that I forgot to add.

"(including digits that you forgot)". I often forget to add sign,I apologize for that. A ꯷ 02:16, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

Did you see that his email is obfuscated ? (as indicated with instructions: clicking the link directly to send a mail, without editing the email address to replace the @ and dot will not work). He also provides various other contacts on several sites. Also your signature is still invalid: you just indicate the date. To get the full signature with your user name, you need to type FOUR tildes ( ~~~~), and make sure that your preferences on this site is correctly configured, i.e. you did not remove completely the user name and link, because you can customize its style, but should still preserve a readable name and a wikilink to your user page (like -- [[User:Awangba Mangang|A ꯷]]) or to your talk page (like -- [[User talk:Awangba Mangang|A ꯷]]). You can add a small text, punctuation or decoration you want around that, and colorize/style your user name if you wish within the link text (the date of your post is added just after that signature when you use the four tildes or click on the signature button). Posting without signing is badly viewed by many users as it confuses the talks when there are multiple users talking. This signature with your user name is required for many activities on wikis, including for voting, so make sure your preferences are correctly set and that you did not remove it. Thanks. Verdy p (talk) 02:19, 31 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

@Verdy p: I have Android keyboard apps But order are not good Facebook has meetei mayek keyboard but order are not like to people as the leeter starts from Kok and ends with Bham. There is keyboard for Meetei mayek above Android 8,but order is same with Facebook apps.

A ꯷ 02:44, 31 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

For the record, these visual layouts use the Unicode encoding order (of base letters in the main block only, plus the vowel suppressor and one punctuation sign, but not any diacritic for the Facebook layout). These base layouts also don't contain the digits (possibly in the alternate input layout or by pressing a key for longer time with the Android input). These visual layouts are not intended to be layouts for physical keyboards and there's no relation at all to QWERTY or transliteration from Latin. Verdy p (talk) 09:35, 31 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

I need your help[edit source]

@Verdy p: I can't correct this Module error A ꯷ 04:50, 21 September 2019 (UTC)Reply

Where did you take this module (before trying to modify it for that language) ? From which wiki ?
The error indicates an additional missing dependant module that you did not import but which is integrant part of the initial module from the wiki you used to import...
The initial wiki has naming conventions for its additional data modules (here modules by language): you would need to import possibly a lot of additional data modules and make sure that the naming conventions are applicable here: note that this wiki has specific requirements as it requires prefixes (here "Mt/mni/") which is not used in the code you imported from a wiki that does not need this prefix.
But you imported the module in a language neutral namespace (without the prefix) so you should NOT attempt to modify it with translations specific to the "mni" language.
If you import such module, keep it language neutral, or import it with a language prefix, and you'll probably need lot of edits to make it work the same way it was used in an international wiki.
Your module import, modified like you did, and not working at all, is subject to deletion as it does not follow and respect the naming conventions: Incubator requires strict separation and classification of hosted projects, you cannot use generic namespaces safely and hope that the incubator will be usable after being imported to a final wiki, if it gets approved and finally created.
Also your new module would break all other incubator projects (for other languages) trying to use it.
So I repeat this question: why do you need this module ? Where it comes from, what is the unmodified original? Such import under a genetic name should avoid changing any translations (e.g. substituting English to another language). This remark applies on modules, like on templates and articles: they must be properly prefixed, or MUST remain generic and language neutral, and for this wiki making language neutral modules is a bit more complicate than on international wikis (like Commons or MetaWiki) and localized wikis (like Wikipedia which can be localized directly in addition to not requiring any prefix). Verdy p (talk) 09:13, 21 September 2019 (UTC)Reply

Happy New year🎇[edit source]

Hi,@Verdy p: can you help this module error Wp/mni/ꯈꯝꯕ ꯊꯣꯏꯕꯤ. A ꯷ 02:33, 13 January 2021 (UTC)Reply

Simple fix: the module was expanding a template without specifying the "Wp/mni/" required prefix. You cannot create templates on this wiki without those prefixes.
Beside this, I made the minimal changes; other things need to be translated or adapted. Importing modules or tempaltes from English Wikiopedia does not work immediately, you always need those extra prefixes on Incubator. Verdy p (talk) 16:20, 13 January 2021 (UTC)Reply

Speciesbox[edit source]

This page Template:Wp/mni/Speciesbox need your help. Thank 😊 you in advance! A ꯷ 02:57, 22 January 2021 (UTC)Reply