Talk:Wp/cop/ⲙⲉⲑⲣⲏ

    From Wikimedia Incubator

    Hi ⲁϩⲙⲉⲧ, what are the etymologies of these names please? - AB

    I guess old Coptic and Hieroglyphic, as I recognize the name for Mars. Ψενανουβισ (talk) 00:59, 27 February 2018 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    I know, but I'm asking for the etymology in each case. - AB
    I cannot give you the etymology for each case, we'll see what ⲁϩⲙⲉⲧ says. But ḥr(w) dšr "Horus the Red" for Mars - ϩⲁⲣⲑⲱϣ is clear. Venus ⲛⲉⲧⲟⲟⲩⲓ from nṯr dw3j and Mercury - ⲥⲟⲩⲕⲏ from Sbk. Jupiter - ϩⲁⲣⲡϣⲱⲧ from ḥr(w) (p3) št. Saturn ϩⲁⲣⲡⲭⲟ from ḥr p3 k3. Ψενανουβισ (talk) 02:10, 27 February 2018 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    Salam, Ψενανουβισ explained already the ones from Mercury to Saturn. For Neptun, I took ḥr p3 mfk3t (ϩⲁⲣⲡⲙϥⲏⲕⲓ), although I just realized it should rather be ϩⲁⲣⲑⲙϥⲏⲕⲓ, I apologize. And for Uranus, I took ḥr m p.t ϩⲁⲣⲙⲫⲏ. Greetings, ⲁϩⲙⲉⲧ (talk) 15:21, 27 February 2018 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    Thanks ⲁϩⲙⲉⲧ - that's interesting. Apart from ϩⲁⲣⲡϣⲱⲧ, ⲥⲟⲩⲭⲏ and obviously ⲡⲓⲕⲁϩⲓ are any of these others attested in Coptic (or Old Coptic) or are they constructions based on pre-Coptic names? Also, do you know that the Scala Magna gives a list of planet names: ⲣⲏⲫⲁⲛ Saturn, ⲡⲓⲍⲉⲩⲥ Jupiter, ⲙⲟⲗⲟⲭ Mars, ⲥⲟⲩⲣⲟⲧ Venus, ⲡⲓⲉⲣⲙⲏⲥ Mercury (= Kircher p. 49)? Obviously they're all Greek names or loaned via Greek but ⲙⲟⲗⲟⲭ is at least attested in pre-Coptic Egyptian, namely, Demotic mlẖ (Vycichl p. 111). - AB
    Except for Neptun and Uranus, they are attested in Demotic and Graeco-Roman texts. Yeah, the Scala Magna names seem to be a list of Semitic and Greek names, although I don't know where ⲡⲓⲍⲉⲩⲥ comes from. Interesting. ⲁϩⲙⲉⲧ (talk) 16:22, 27 February 2018 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    The Roman god Jupiter was equated with the Greek god Zeus. Zeus appears twice in the NT (Acts 14:12&13) as ⲡⲓⲍⲉⲩⲥ. The other names given in the Scala Magna are all also attested in the NT/OT except ⲥⲟⲩⲣⲟⲧ 'Venus' which appears to be Egyptian but only attested in the Scala Magna. Do you have any idea as to its etymology? - AB

    Ah yeah, now I see. "The Zeus" haha.. Hmm the first part in ⲥⲟⲩⲣⲟⲧ could be from ⲥⲓⲟⲩ, ⲥⲟⲩ-, but I don't know the last compound. Is the Venus known to be a waxing planet? If so, it could be ⲥⲟⲩⲣⲱⲧ, although I think this is just me trying to fit in something. I thought it is some corrupted from of زهرة. ⲁϩⲙⲉⲧ (talk) 16:59, 27 February 2018 (UTC)Reply[reply]

    Yes, possibly. I don't think Westerndorf, Cerny nor Vycichl give an etymology. Another possibility is ⲥⲟⲩ- + ⲉⲣⲟⲩⲟⲧ 'gladness, etc' (Sah. ⲟⲩⲣⲟⲧ) so 'star of gladness, radiance, etc' (like زهرة). - AB
    Do you think the Bohairic orthography is ⲥⲟⲩⲭⲏ? Ϯⲙⲉⲗⲗⲓⲥⲏⲧ (talk) 17:57, 27 February 2018 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    I think it is ⲥⲟⲩⲕⲏ. ⲁϩⲙⲉⲧ (talk) 17:58, 27 February 2018 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    Yeah, sorry that's my mistake - I meant ⲥⲟⲩⲕⲏ. - AB
    I don't think we should use any of the Greek and Arabic names, but maybe we can think of names for Neptune and Uranus? All the other ones I like, but there are obviously no Coptic and Demotic words for Neptune and Uranus. If, and only if, ⲥⲟⲩⲣⲟⲧ is genuine Coptic and not just from Arabic, we could use it instead of ⲛⲉⲧⲟⲟⲩⲓ. ⲁⲛⲉⲯⲓⲟⲩⲥⲓⲣⲓ (talk) 21:52, 6 July 2020 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    Yes, we can have discussion. I created new terms for them, drawing from the meanings of Neptune and Uranus in Graeco-Roman culture, "Blue Horus" for Neptune and "Horus in the sky" for Uranus. But I know that they are made up and people can suggest other words. Suggestions for them can be made below:

    Neptune[edit source]

    • ϩⲁⲣⲡⲙϥⲏⲕⲓ "Turquoise Horus"
    • Or what would be the equation of Neptune = Poseidon in Egyptian mythology? Is it Nun?

    Uranus[edit source]

    • ϩⲁⲣⲙⲫⲏ "Horus in the Sky"
    • Or what would be the equation of Caelus = Uranos in Egyptian mythology? ⲁϩⲙⲉⲧ (talk) 02:31, 7 July 2020 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    What about Nut or Shu? ⲁⲛⲉⲯⲓⲟⲩⲥⲓⲣⲓ (talk) 16:27, 7 July 2020 (UTC)Reply[reply]